The perfect word for getting pleasure from other’s misfortune and pain is the German word - schadenfreude. Millions of Germans during WWII experienced it from the evil side while others embraced the joy. Often we use the English word - psychopath in this instance to describe people who get enjoyment in this manner..
So how does extreme religious organizations grow these “psychopaths” and is it possible to reach them? If we cannot “save” them from their own mental “illness”, how can we defeat them? Reasoning seems impossible because every part of the brain is closed off from compassion, fairness and logic. There aren’t enough deprogrammers in the world!
The above observation does not mean that people cannot escape and build a healthy world for themselves. I know you feel like the work you have done to save yourself seems inadequate or incomplete. But I have to remind you that just a little bit of your old life is your super power. You have a knowledge that I can never fully understand or replicate. Perhaps you need to give yourself some grace and continue to channel all those emotions into your dedicated work.
You know what you do is so very important and when we all succeed into taming the “devil within Christian Nationalists” you will have received your reward for your hard work.
Another great article! I look forward to reading your thoughts every day.
"So how does extreme religious organizations grow these “psychopaths” and is it possible to reach them?"
Extreme religions grow psychopaths and narcissists because they make their version of God responsible for the bad things that happen. It isn't up to anyone to step in and help the suffering, because that might interfere with the lesson God is trying to teach the sufferer. It gives them a pass to eject empathy from their lives and thoughts and actions.
"If we cannot “save” them from their own mental “illness”, how can we defeat them?" I don't know that we'll ever entirely defeat them. I'm doing my part to help people understand that we MUST win the November election. We MUST consider that win a beginning, not a "we've arrived."
As for me, I give myself grace every day. Otherwise, I wouldn't be functional. When I share something like this, I do it because I am warning others of what lies in store for them if Christo-fascist Republicans win. I don't need sympathy or empathy. I don't need anyone to give a damn about me. I have learned how to give myself what I need. Finally.
This is about you and/or people you care about. This is about the world every reader wants to live in, the world they want their children and grandchildren to have. I don't want it to be what I had as a kid. I'd love to avoid another generation of broken people, browbeaten by their ugly, nasty God.
Whenever I hear anyone say well they must follow the Christian faith I always want to ask which Christian faith. Here in Texas if you're a Methodist you'll be damned by the Baptist and the Presbyterian if you're Catholic Oh heaven forbid everybody will be on you if you're a Baptist the others will say you are terrible so exactly which Christian faith are you to follow because they all have their differences.
This is also a problem. Growing up, my Baptist pastor said practically every other denomination was hell bound. Sam Alito is Catholic. Mike Johnson is Baptist. They work together for the same ends now, but each thinks the other’s faith is “wrong.”
It’s not easy for a crowd of people who already point fingers at each other to coalesce and condemn Christian Nationalists.
Great question! It dovetails with a newsletter I'm currently working on, but I may expand it into two reader questions now.
This is one thing that is somewhat different from my Christian Nationalist upbringing. My pastor always stressed that Jesus came to do away with Old Testament law, even as he sometimes cited its rigid dogma on how we should live our lives. This new crowd has factions who openly call for stoning people to death a la Leviticus. (A link to one article since that claim sounds so outrageous on its face: https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/execution-stoning-christian-nationalism-1234797127/)
All to say Christian Nationalists today are more radicalized and extreme than when I was growing up. And that tracks. You can't marinate in this ideology for five decades and not have a fanatical outcome.
I guess what bothers me about this is that I don't see a cohesive, unified effort from other Christians disavowing this movement to take over the country. I see siloed, discrete voices here and there speaking out against Christian Nationalism, but no wide spread, forceful messaging. There are always people asking Muslims to speak out against extremists in their faith when the US is attacked by Islamist extremists. Now is the time for moderate Christians coalesce and speak out to let everyone know they are not OK with Christian Nationalism and to urge people to vote for Biden. To me, it looks like most Christians are complicit and enabling this agenda, whether they are or not.
Historically, many Americans aren’t comfortable calling out the religious passions of others. I think many Christians feel conflicted about this or even wonder if they somehow contributed to it, and that makes it harder to speak up.
We also have the problem that in the minds of many Americans “Christianity” has long been defined as “evangelical Christianity” which has morphed into “Christian Nationalism.” People who don’t talk about their faith because it’s personal have a hard time stepping up and saying, “I’m a Christian, but not this kind of Christian.”
John Pavlovitz uses his pulpit and ministry to write about this. I know other pastors do. But you’re right: More Christians need to say something.
When I was growing up we attended Lutheran churchs occasionally. They were like the milk toast of religions. No hell fire and brimstone. Half the congregation was hungover on Sunday. We made our paper Jesus and had snacks. It was pretty tame. Except for my dad laying on the car horn yelling at my mom to get 4 kids ready on time. He's still an asshole.
But I did join a Bible study 30 years ago because my neighbor drove me nuts about it. I did attended an Evangelical church with her for about a year. So I got a taste of it. I didn't stay long because of the hypocrisy. I was asked(by the church) to form a group for those struggling mental health issues. I didn't last long. That was a kinda of crazy way above my pay grade. I can't even put it into words. I do not believe in God anymore.
If an alien came to earth and read the First Testament, they would think a malignant narcissist/psychopath was in charge. That's why other malignant narcissist/psychopaths love this shit. It justifies their crimes against humanity.
Humans need to belong, feel validation and find purpose. They are looking in the wrong places.
How did they have you conduct this group? Read the Bible and pray?
So many churches use cult-like tactics to suck people in and make them feel like they belong. Then when they let everything else go, the church starts manipulating them. So many feel like they’ll lose everything if they leave. And they generally do. It’s a valid fear.
I think church speaks to some people and reaches them in ways nothing else would. Some churches are wonderful.
But I think everyone should be free to find and practice what speaks to them.
I worked in mental health. No, I did not read the Bible or pray. I came at in a more secular form. They were able to talk about what was happening in their lives. A number of women were in abusive relationships. I would try to separate behaviors from God and personal responsibility. I used a lot of empathy. But it always came back to God's will. Tough crowd. Some of them need long term professional care and medications. There were obvious personality disorders.
I agree with you. Worship whatever. Unless it's oppressive and abusive. That crosses the line. Those actions become all our problem.
The perfect word for getting pleasure from other’s misfortune and pain is the German word - schadenfreude. Millions of Germans during WWII experienced it from the evil side while others embraced the joy. Often we use the English word - psychopath in this instance to describe people who get enjoyment in this manner..
So how does extreme religious organizations grow these “psychopaths” and is it possible to reach them? If we cannot “save” them from their own mental “illness”, how can we defeat them? Reasoning seems impossible because every part of the brain is closed off from compassion, fairness and logic. There aren’t enough deprogrammers in the world!
The above observation does not mean that people cannot escape and build a healthy world for themselves. I know you feel like the work you have done to save yourself seems inadequate or incomplete. But I have to remind you that just a little bit of your old life is your super power. You have a knowledge that I can never fully understand or replicate. Perhaps you need to give yourself some grace and continue to channel all those emotions into your dedicated work.
You know what you do is so very important and when we all succeed into taming the “devil within Christian Nationalists” you will have received your reward for your hard work.
Another great article! I look forward to reading your thoughts every day.
"So how does extreme religious organizations grow these “psychopaths” and is it possible to reach them?"
Extreme religions grow psychopaths and narcissists because they make their version of God responsible for the bad things that happen. It isn't up to anyone to step in and help the suffering, because that might interfere with the lesson God is trying to teach the sufferer. It gives them a pass to eject empathy from their lives and thoughts and actions.
"If we cannot “save” them from their own mental “illness”, how can we defeat them?" I don't know that we'll ever entirely defeat them. I'm doing my part to help people understand that we MUST win the November election. We MUST consider that win a beginning, not a "we've arrived."
As for me, I give myself grace every day. Otherwise, I wouldn't be functional. When I share something like this, I do it because I am warning others of what lies in store for them if Christo-fascist Republicans win. I don't need sympathy or empathy. I don't need anyone to give a damn about me. I have learned how to give myself what I need. Finally.
This is about you and/or people you care about. This is about the world every reader wants to live in, the world they want their children and grandchildren to have. I don't want it to be what I had as a kid. I'd love to avoid another generation of broken people, browbeaten by their ugly, nasty God.
You rock! I admire your willingness to go all out.
All out is all I know how to be. 😜
Whenever I hear anyone say well they must follow the Christian faith I always want to ask which Christian faith. Here in Texas if you're a Methodist you'll be damned by the Baptist and the Presbyterian if you're Catholic Oh heaven forbid everybody will be on you if you're a Baptist the others will say you are terrible so exactly which Christian faith are you to follow because they all have their differences.
This is also a problem. Growing up, my Baptist pastor said practically every other denomination was hell bound. Sam Alito is Catholic. Mike Johnson is Baptist. They work together for the same ends now, but each thinks the other’s faith is “wrong.”
It’s not easy for a crowd of people who already point fingers at each other to coalesce and condemn Christian Nationalists.
Great article....as always. These people are sick and twisted. They are NO different than the Taliban. Just a different book.
How did they get hooked on the OT instead of NT?? While they are both works of fiction.
Because OT gives them more control?
Great question! It dovetails with a newsletter I'm currently working on, but I may expand it into two reader questions now.
This is one thing that is somewhat different from my Christian Nationalist upbringing. My pastor always stressed that Jesus came to do away with Old Testament law, even as he sometimes cited its rigid dogma on how we should live our lives. This new crowd has factions who openly call for stoning people to death a la Leviticus. (A link to one article since that claim sounds so outrageous on its face: https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/execution-stoning-christian-nationalism-1234797127/)
All to say Christian Nationalists today are more radicalized and extreme than when I was growing up. And that tracks. You can't marinate in this ideology for five decades and not have a fanatical outcome.
Geez....stoning. these people are outrageous
At least you can feel confident comparing them to the Taliban. The latter just reintroduced stoning women to death for adultery in Afghanistan.
I guess what bothers me about this is that I don't see a cohesive, unified effort from other Christians disavowing this movement to take over the country. I see siloed, discrete voices here and there speaking out against Christian Nationalism, but no wide spread, forceful messaging. There are always people asking Muslims to speak out against extremists in their faith when the US is attacked by Islamist extremists. Now is the time for moderate Christians coalesce and speak out to let everyone know they are not OK with Christian Nationalism and to urge people to vote for Biden. To me, it looks like most Christians are complicit and enabling this agenda, whether they are or not.
Historically, many Americans aren’t comfortable calling out the religious passions of others. I think many Christians feel conflicted about this or even wonder if they somehow contributed to it, and that makes it harder to speak up.
We also have the problem that in the minds of many Americans “Christianity” has long been defined as “evangelical Christianity” which has morphed into “Christian Nationalism.” People who don’t talk about their faith because it’s personal have a hard time stepping up and saying, “I’m a Christian, but not this kind of Christian.”
John Pavlovitz uses his pulpit and ministry to write about this. I know other pastors do. But you’re right: More Christians need to say something.
When I was growing up we attended Lutheran churchs occasionally. They were like the milk toast of religions. No hell fire and brimstone. Half the congregation was hungover on Sunday. We made our paper Jesus and had snacks. It was pretty tame. Except for my dad laying on the car horn yelling at my mom to get 4 kids ready on time. He's still an asshole.
But I did join a Bible study 30 years ago because my neighbor drove me nuts about it. I did attended an Evangelical church with her for about a year. So I got a taste of it. I didn't stay long because of the hypocrisy. I was asked(by the church) to form a group for those struggling mental health issues. I didn't last long. That was a kinda of crazy way above my pay grade. I can't even put it into words. I do not believe in God anymore.
If an alien came to earth and read the First Testament, they would think a malignant narcissist/psychopath was in charge. That's why other malignant narcissist/psychopaths love this shit. It justifies their crimes against humanity.
Humans need to belong, feel validation and find purpose. They are looking in the wrong places.
How did they have you conduct this group? Read the Bible and pray?
So many churches use cult-like tactics to suck people in and make them feel like they belong. Then when they let everything else go, the church starts manipulating them. So many feel like they’ll lose everything if they leave. And they generally do. It’s a valid fear.
I think church speaks to some people and reaches them in ways nothing else would. Some churches are wonderful.
But I think everyone should be free to find and practice what speaks to them.
I worked in mental health. No, I did not read the Bible or pray. I came at in a more secular form. They were able to talk about what was happening in their lives. A number of women were in abusive relationships. I would try to separate behaviors from God and personal responsibility. I used a lot of empathy. But it always came back to God's will. Tough crowd. Some of them need long term professional care and medications. There were obvious personality disorders.
I agree with you. Worship whatever. Unless it's oppressive and abusive. That crosses the line. Those actions become all our problem.
Yoda summed it best in Star Wars, Ep. 1-The Phantom Menace:
"Fear leads to Anger, Anger leads to Hate, and Hate... leads to Suffering."
I hope more Americans will start paying attention.
I hope youll post the Lincoln Project interview. Or a link please
I'll post a link when it's up. Not sure when it will be live.
Hi Julie, one doesn’t really need a link, just open the podcast app on an iPhone (or whatever podcast app is used on android) I search for
The Enemy’s List
Sorry if I caused confusion, my question was for Andra for her upcoming interview on the Lincoln Project
I don't think you caused confusion. I'll make sure you have a link when it's live.