This topic raises my blood pressure. It was so hard to stay up on tax changes and the tax code without devolving into complete, total cynicism. I can't promise that cynicism won't come through this week.
And you are correct... people have very low attention spans, this is another reason why the Republican states are lowering their working age for teenagers and offer waaaay more co-op programs than before...... , this is all an effort to streamline them from high school directly into service or factory jobs- instead of going to college which is what they should be doing. Republicans know the allure of money, even if only $35,000 per year, is hard to resist when your family is already struggling. It's about keeping people in caste system.
Exactly correct, rump roast gave huge tax benefits to rich households and corporate America. It's a big reason our US debt is so high. This all started with Ronny boy Reagan drastically lowering the taxes on rich and corporate America. His fake trickle down economics. It's astounding that people don't bother to look at taxes under democrat vs Republican. They just blindly flip. the R levers.
Business “news” is a big problem. You can always find an expert who’s willing to say trickle down economics works (as an example.) Business news is largely infotainment and propaganda designed by billionaires to keep Americans financially illiterate, all while those same Americans think they’re super-informed because they consume that news.
Some non-partisan groups do a decent job of explaining these issues. I’m linking to a Pew research study tomorrow.
I hope they will read with an open mind. It is maddening to try to convince them to vote for their own interests instead of voting for billionaires to pay no tax.
Great! I'm dyslexic in math. And my husband has me do the finances. He's actually much better than I am, but he hates to do it. I admire your math perseverance. Thank you for breaking Project 2025 down. I appreciate it your work. This shit lives in my head.
Promise kept. Refraining from 'vulgar' language can enhance creativity - 'give one good bowel movement'. Love it!
I'm sure we could talk about this topic forever (and neither one of us would get anything else done today :) but I believe pretty strongly that it would be better if we could tax wealth than income. But I'm not sure if it can be done or how to do it.
And, as a bit of a counterpoint I guess, also with taxes I am sometimes less concerned with what's fair than what's effective. The problem I see with taxes is they are hard to collect because people avoid them. And I don't even mean illegally, though plenty of that happens, but I just mean that people modify their behavior to lower their tax, and the wealthier they are the more they do it. There is always a loophole or something to exploit, and those are often there for good intentions. You're a CPA so you know what I'm talking about. It's not so simple to just tax 'wealth' or 'income' because you have to precisely define what those are. And the wealthier someone is the more complicated that becomes.
So sometimes I just think, how can we maximize the tax intake so that we can pay for things our society needs. I think in many European countries the tax system is less progressive, but it's made up for by social spending?
So much to unpack in this topic, and you have decades of relevant life experience here, while I have decades of a subscription to The Economist :)
The BM line got past my censor. Calling billionaires “assholes” did not.
Biden is proposing a 25% billionaire tax. I don’t know details to compute. Because you’re right. Most of them would be like 45 and say, “I am the richest person alive,” when they needed loans or investment and “My portfolio is worth nothing” when paying taxes.
Getting into offshore vehicles for avoiding tax is also hugely complex. I don’t plan to make our discussions here that financially difficult, though I personally enjoy them. They can turn geeky very fast.
I’m learning about Spain’s tax system. One very quickly gets to a 48% tax on most types on income. And one pays that rate on all income, not merely the amount above the threshold. And they can freaking come to your house and harass you if you don’t pay. But they have a much better social safety net.
Americans are truly clueless about the high taxes they pay for little return. We have wage withholdings. Gas tax. Sin taxes on booze built into the price. Sales taxes. Property taxes. Taxes built into the cost of airline tickets and similar. Not to mention things I call taxes but aren’t: How I constantly worry about losing my health insurance; how one election can undo everything we’ve spent our adult lives working for; the fraud and corruption that fuels our economy.
People - all people - should pay taxes. Including corporations since the stupid Supreme Court deemed them people. Resolving how taxes should be paid is above my pay grade, but they could be simpler. They could apply to everyone. And we could all have nice things.
It's tricky, because the United States is one of the world's wealthiest countries, and I don't think that's completely unconnected to taxation, but I also think we could do a lot better without harming our economy. Maybe I'm wrong and maybe the only reason we're wealthier is our large population, natural resources, etc. so maybe there isn't as much to lose idk.
Trump is a perfect example of why I favor taxing wealth over income. No question he has a lot of wealth. But he's also very bad at business so it wouldn't surprise me if his income is much lower and even negative. I think wealth is a better determinant of both ability and moral obligation to pay than income. Although my argument would also tax the elderly much more, and that would be a political non-starter if ever there was one.
Resolving our tax problems is a political non-starter. Because it is really about resolving our deficit and debt. Everyone seems happy to kick that can down the road until the can turns out to be a nuclear mine that detonates. Hopefully not on their watch or in their lifetime.
So instead the wealthy avoid paying much by buying our politicians. We take up the slack, but it’s not enough to cover the ballooning problem of the nuclear can. And when it all blows up, lives will be ruined while those who did the ruining are either dead or blame everyone but themselves.
That's a tough one too. There's a sense in which I don't think the deficit and debt are as big of problems as some think. I think of the dollar as being the world's currency and the debt as being the supply of dollars. We benefit a lot from it, in ability to consume more than we produce. But what matters is interest on the debt, so for that reason the size of the debt and interest rates are important. And that of course me means the question is how low rates can be without unacceptable inflation. Idk if we've moved into that new era yet or if this is more of a blip. If it is more permanent we have some policy choices we have to make.
I think they’re both a bigger deal now than they were several decades ago. We’re kind of in an economic no man’s land. We have levers we can pull to react to blips, but those can only work for so long. In theory. And that doesn’t account for the fact that our markets are designed to go up and down. Bull and bear markets are healthy. The market is not designed to constantly appreciate.
Not to mention how insane it makes me that most Americans entire financial education comes from news headlines like “Dow Sets Another Record High.” Americans would be far better off to actually invest time and mental energy into learning how this stuff works. But like most investments, Americans by-and-large prefer to avoid them, get whatever they can for nothing, and spend $5000 on concert tickets. Or whatever.
I sound like an asshole, but talking about this stuff really makes me disappointed in the bulk of my fellow country people.
All I know is when Republicans are in charge, I'm going to pay for it. I can't afford them. I don't have another do-over in me. The Recession was a killer for my family. It took years to recover.
Our system supports the wealthy. Our laws support the wealthy. Our laws to protect the wealthy are racist. They are based on Jim Crow laws. We have systematic racism layered and law in our banks. It cost a fortune to be poor or broke ass in this country.
The Heritage Foundation wrote the book for Reagan's administration. I read Project 2025 wants a 30% flat tax across the board for everyone. How does that work? Could you explain? I'm not a numbers person.
You're in luck, Lisa. Today's post addresses the proposed tax rate changes for most Americans. They propose 15% or 30% depending upon income across the board. I have scenarios in today's newsletter to illustrate how that could shake out.
I think it costs a fortune to be an American unless you're obscenely wealthy.
Great information, and your writing itself is also on fire.
This topic raises my blood pressure. It was so hard to stay up on tax changes and the tax code without devolving into complete, total cynicism. I can't promise that cynicism won't come through this week.
Go for it. Your best writing is your honest, passionate writing!
And you are correct... people have very low attention spans, this is another reason why the Republican states are lowering their working age for teenagers and offer waaaay more co-op programs than before...... , this is all an effort to streamline them from high school directly into service or factory jobs- instead of going to college which is what they should be doing. Republicans know the allure of money, even if only $35,000 per year, is hard to resist when your family is already struggling. It's about keeping people in caste system.
I have so many feelings about red-state child labor. It appalls me.
Exactly correct, rump roast gave huge tax benefits to rich households and corporate America. It's a big reason our US debt is so high. This all started with Ronny boy Reagan drastically lowering the taxes on rich and corporate America. His fake trickle down economics. It's astounding that people don't bother to look at taxes under democrat vs Republican. They just blindly flip. the R levers.
Business “news” is a big problem. You can always find an expert who’s willing to say trickle down economics works (as an example.) Business news is largely infotainment and propaganda designed by billionaires to keep Americans financially illiterate, all while those same Americans think they’re super-informed because they consume that news.
Some non-partisan groups do a decent job of explaining these issues. I’m linking to a Pew research study tomorrow.
Thank you for this explanation. I will try to pass it on to the few MAGA friends I still have.
I hope they will read with an open mind. It is maddening to try to convince them to vote for their own interests instead of voting for billionaires to pay no tax.
Great! I'm dyslexic in math. And my husband has me do the finances. He's actually much better than I am, but he hates to do it. I admire your math perseverance. Thank you for breaking Project 2025 down. I appreciate it your work. This shit lives in my head.
Thank you for supporting this work financially, and for being such an engaged reader. You make this work better.
Promise kept. Refraining from 'vulgar' language can enhance creativity - 'give one good bowel movement'. Love it!
I'm sure we could talk about this topic forever (and neither one of us would get anything else done today :) but I believe pretty strongly that it would be better if we could tax wealth than income. But I'm not sure if it can be done or how to do it.
And, as a bit of a counterpoint I guess, also with taxes I am sometimes less concerned with what's fair than what's effective. The problem I see with taxes is they are hard to collect because people avoid them. And I don't even mean illegally, though plenty of that happens, but I just mean that people modify their behavior to lower their tax, and the wealthier they are the more they do it. There is always a loophole or something to exploit, and those are often there for good intentions. You're a CPA so you know what I'm talking about. It's not so simple to just tax 'wealth' or 'income' because you have to precisely define what those are. And the wealthier someone is the more complicated that becomes.
So sometimes I just think, how can we maximize the tax intake so that we can pay for things our society needs. I think in many European countries the tax system is less progressive, but it's made up for by social spending?
So much to unpack in this topic, and you have decades of relevant life experience here, while I have decades of a subscription to The Economist :)
The BM line got past my censor. Calling billionaires “assholes” did not.
Biden is proposing a 25% billionaire tax. I don’t know details to compute. Because you’re right. Most of them would be like 45 and say, “I am the richest person alive,” when they needed loans or investment and “My portfolio is worth nothing” when paying taxes.
Getting into offshore vehicles for avoiding tax is also hugely complex. I don’t plan to make our discussions here that financially difficult, though I personally enjoy them. They can turn geeky very fast.
I’m learning about Spain’s tax system. One very quickly gets to a 48% tax on most types on income. And one pays that rate on all income, not merely the amount above the threshold. And they can freaking come to your house and harass you if you don’t pay. But they have a much better social safety net.
Americans are truly clueless about the high taxes they pay for little return. We have wage withholdings. Gas tax. Sin taxes on booze built into the price. Sales taxes. Property taxes. Taxes built into the cost of airline tickets and similar. Not to mention things I call taxes but aren’t: How I constantly worry about losing my health insurance; how one election can undo everything we’ve spent our adult lives working for; the fraud and corruption that fuels our economy.
People - all people - should pay taxes. Including corporations since the stupid Supreme Court deemed them people. Resolving how taxes should be paid is above my pay grade, but they could be simpler. They could apply to everyone. And we could all have nice things.
It's tricky, because the United States is one of the world's wealthiest countries, and I don't think that's completely unconnected to taxation, but I also think we could do a lot better without harming our economy. Maybe I'm wrong and maybe the only reason we're wealthier is our large population, natural resources, etc. so maybe there isn't as much to lose idk.
Trump is a perfect example of why I favor taxing wealth over income. No question he has a lot of wealth. But he's also very bad at business so it wouldn't surprise me if his income is much lower and even negative. I think wealth is a better determinant of both ability and moral obligation to pay than income. Although my argument would also tax the elderly much more, and that would be a political non-starter if ever there was one.
Resolving our tax problems is a political non-starter. Because it is really about resolving our deficit and debt. Everyone seems happy to kick that can down the road until the can turns out to be a nuclear mine that detonates. Hopefully not on their watch or in their lifetime.
So instead the wealthy avoid paying much by buying our politicians. We take up the slack, but it’s not enough to cover the ballooning problem of the nuclear can. And when it all blows up, lives will be ruined while those who did the ruining are either dead or blame everyone but themselves.
That's a tough one too. There's a sense in which I don't think the deficit and debt are as big of problems as some think. I think of the dollar as being the world's currency and the debt as being the supply of dollars. We benefit a lot from it, in ability to consume more than we produce. But what matters is interest on the debt, so for that reason the size of the debt and interest rates are important. And that of course me means the question is how low rates can be without unacceptable inflation. Idk if we've moved into that new era yet or if this is more of a blip. If it is more permanent we have some policy choices we have to make.
I think they’re both a bigger deal now than they were several decades ago. We’re kind of in an economic no man’s land. We have levers we can pull to react to blips, but those can only work for so long. In theory. And that doesn’t account for the fact that our markets are designed to go up and down. Bull and bear markets are healthy. The market is not designed to constantly appreciate.
Not to mention how insane it makes me that most Americans entire financial education comes from news headlines like “Dow Sets Another Record High.” Americans would be far better off to actually invest time and mental energy into learning how this stuff works. But like most investments, Americans by-and-large prefer to avoid them, get whatever they can for nothing, and spend $5000 on concert tickets. Or whatever.
I sound like an asshole, but talking about this stuff really makes me disappointed in the bulk of my fellow country people.
All I know is when Republicans are in charge, I'm going to pay for it. I can't afford them. I don't have another do-over in me. The Recession was a killer for my family. It took years to recover.
Our system supports the wealthy. Our laws support the wealthy. Our laws to protect the wealthy are racist. They are based on Jim Crow laws. We have systematic racism layered and law in our banks. It cost a fortune to be poor or broke ass in this country.
The Heritage Foundation wrote the book for Reagan's administration. I read Project 2025 wants a 30% flat tax across the board for everyone. How does that work? Could you explain? I'm not a numbers person.
You're in luck, Lisa. Today's post addresses the proposed tax rate changes for most Americans. They propose 15% or 30% depending upon income across the board. I have scenarios in today's newsletter to illustrate how that could shake out.
I think it costs a fortune to be an American unless you're obscenely wealthy.